Xavier Game Thread

[bluejayfan00]

Depth/bench has been an issue way more than it hasn't under Mac. I would love to win in NYC one year, but it won't happen until we have a bench and don't have to play 5 guys 30+ minutes

[WBR Tom]

all of that's true - but I never want to hear Mac talk about depth again like he has the last two preseasons.

he creates a lot of this sort of conversation by doing that - i'm sure there is some design there to keep guys believing they will get some PT. But - he just isn't going to. I wish I could remember back to his UNI teams and recall whether he was this way there as well - alas CRS here.

KenPom goes back to 2006-07 for that data. Mac's bench minutes (D1 rank in para):

2024: 21.4% (351st)
2023: 19.7% (351st)
2022: 23.7% (312th)
2021: 23.4% (317th)
2020: 19.4% (343th)
2019: 26.5% (269th)
2018: 35.5% (71st)
2017: 34.2% (113th)
2016: 35.4% (91st)
2015: 38.8% (39th)
2014: 27.0% (251st)
2013: 25.6% (273rd)
2012: 29.9% (192nd)
2011: 32.0% (136th)

---Iowa State

2010: 27.6% (250th)
2009: 31.5% (151st)
2008: 30.0% (197th)
2007: 27.9% (233rd)

His UNI teams predate the KenPom database for stats that deep, but they were generally in that same ballpark. The 2005-06 team only had three bench players get more than 10% of the team's minutes; 2004-05 had four; 2003-04 had five.

Dana of course was the polar opposite -- and used to get a lot of criticism, especially late in his tenure, for seeming to stifle momentum by pulling 3, 4 or 5 guys all at once. I'd argue some of those late Dana era teams went too far to the other extreme; giving your bench nearly half the minutes seems excessive.

2010: 45.3% (3rd)
2009: 42.6% (3rd)
2008: 44.3% (4th)
2007: 26.5% (263rd)

[DC_JAY]

all of that's true - but I never want to hear Mac talk about depth again like he has the last two preseasons.

he creates a lot of this sort of conversation by doing that - i'm sure there is some design there to keep guys believing they will get some PT. But - he just isn't going to. I wish I could remember back to his UNI teams and recall whether he was this way there as well - alas CRS here.

KenPom goes back to 2006-07 for that data. Mac's bench minutes (D1 rank in para):

2024: 21.4% (351st)
2023: 19.7% (351st)
2022: 23.7% (312th)
2021: 23.4% (317th)
2020: 19.4% (343th)
2019: 26.5% (269th)
2018: 35.5% (71st)
2017: 34.2% (113th)
2016: 35.4% (91st)
2015: 38.8% (39th)
2014: 27.0% (251st)
2013: 25.6% (273rd)
2012: 29.9% (192nd)
2011: 32.0% (136th)

---Iowa State

2010: 27.6% (250th)
2009: 31.5% (151st)
2008: 30.0% (197th)
2007: 27.9% (233rd)

His UNI teams predate the KenPom database for stats that deep, but they were generally in that same ballpark. The 2005-06 team only had three bench players get more than 10% of the team's minutes; 2004-05 had four; 2003-04 had five.

Dana of course was the polar opposite -- and used to get a lot of criticism, especially late in his tenure, for seeming to stifle momentum by pulling 3, 4 or 5 guys all at once. I'd argue some of those late Dana era teams went too far to the other extreme; giving your bench nearly half the minutes seems excessive.

2010: 45.3% (3rd)
2009: 42.6% (3rd)
2008: 44.3% (4th)
2007: 26.5% (263rd)

Excellent stats. Thanks. It would seem that the greatest stretch in Jays' history (2020-present) coincided with the least bench time. Coincidence?

[BBfan]

Anyone sit in the section opposite the visiting team's bench - Section 103 or 104 maybe? From the other corner of the arena, my observation has been that section is the closest to the basket that we play defense under in the second half but the crowd in that section is the slowest and/or most reluctant to get up and yell during our 2nd half defensive possessions. Those tired legs might need you tonight! Go Jays!

[AttyAlum]

Depth/bench has been an issue way more than it hasn't under Mac. I would love to win in NYC one year, but it won't happen until we have a bench and don't have to play 5 guys 30+ minutes

I’ve actually stopped going to the conference tourney largely for this reason. I now dedicate my money toward the NCAA tourney. Travel is a little more challenging because you don’t know the locale until days before, but winning an NCAA tourney game is so much more fun.

[cujaysfan]

all of that's true - but I never want to hear Mac talk about depth again like he has the last two preseasons.

he creates a lot of this sort of conversation by doing that - i'm sure there is some design there to keep guys believing they will get some PT. But - he just isn't going to. I wish I could remember back to his UNI teams and recall whether he was this way there as well - alas CRS here.

KenPom goes back to 2006-07 for that data. Mac's bench minutes (D1 rank in para):

2024: 21.4% (351st)
2023: 19.7% (351st)
2022: 23.7% (312th)
2021: 23.4% (317th)
2020: 19.4% (343th)
2019: 26.5% (269th)
2018: 35.5% (71st)
2017: 34.2% (113th)
2016: 35.4% (91st)
2015: 38.8% (39th)
2014: 27.0% (251st)
2013: 25.6% (273rd)
2012: 29.9% (192nd)
2011: 32.0% (136th)

---Iowa State

2010: 27.6% (250th)
2009: 31.5% (151st)
2008: 30.0% (197th)
2007: 27.9% (233rd)

His UNI teams predate the KenPom database for stats that deep, but they were generally in that same ballpark. The 2005-06 team only had three bench players get more than 10% of the team's minutes; 2004-05 had four; 2003-04 had five.

Dana of course was the polar opposite -- and used to get a lot of criticism, especially late in his tenure, for seeming to stifle momentum by pulling 3, 4 or 5 guys all at once. I'd argue some of those late Dana era teams went too far to the other extreme; giving your bench nearly half the minutes seems excessive.

2010: 45.3% (3rd)
2009: 42.6% (3rd)
2008: 44.3% (4th)
2007: 26.5% (263rd)

Damn. Ask and you shall receive. Thanks Tom. I agree with you regarding middle ground btw Mac and Dana. Just from a future development standpoint. DA may have been thinking all along about getting good seed for MVC tournament and then winning it as the surest way into NCAAs. He's not a future HOFer for nothing

[WBR Tom]

Here's the funny thing. Dana cut back on his bench usage once he got to Oregon by a lot -- his teams in Eugene have had a slightly bigger rotation than Mac's, but not by a huge amount in an average year. It's almost 15 years of data showing his Ducks teams have, by and large, had a lot shorter bench than his teams at CU did. I wonder if not having to put all of your chips in on one weekend in March to get a bid to the NCAA's changed his thinking. Something definitely changed.

2024: 34.8% (109th)
2023: 35.5% (64th)
2022: 28.3% (240th)
2021: 28.5% (237th)
2020: 31.2% (146th)
2019: 32.4% (123rd)
2018: 28.9% (239th)
2017: 28.8% (245th)
2016: 26.1% (313th)
2015: 30.3% (224th)
2014: 32.2% (135th)
2013: 32.4% (120th)
2012: 34.5% (79th)
2011: 30.8% (173rd)

There could be something to that. Of the top 50 teams in terms of bench usage this year, only six come from power conferences. Last year, it was five. In 2022, it was six. In 2021, it was seven.

At the other end of the spectrum, of the bottom 50 teams, 10 are from power leagues. In 2023 it was 13. In 2022 it was 16.

To some extent, Mac's average bench usage is pretty typical among power conference teams -- with the obvious caveat that the last two years have been extreme outliers.

[SeattleJay]

Interesting that Mac mentioned Dotzler and Green as playing well. Hopefully, they will earn a few minutes tonight.

Have heard very little about Lawson this season after getting about 16 minutes a game at Memphis last year. You would think the Miller’s would know him well before bringing him in.

[SonofFrankTomera]

Interesting that Mac mentioned Dotzler and Green as playing well. Hopefully, they will earn a few minutes tonight.

Have heard very little about Lawson this season after getting about 16 minutes a game at Memphis last year. You would think the Miller’s would know him well before bringing him in.

I have wondered if that outburst he had in the game on the summer trip (where he was hit in the groin and had the ball thrown at his groin by two separate players on the same team) got him put in the dog house which he has been unable to get out of.

[JacobPadilla]

Interesting that Mac mentioned Dotzler and Green as playing well. Hopefully, they will earn a few minutes tonight.

Have heard very little about Lawson this season after getting about 16 minutes a game at Memphis last year. You would think the Miller’s would know him well before bringing him in.

I have wondered if that outburst he had in the game on the summer trip (where he was hit in the groin and had the ball thrown at his groin by two separate players on the same team) got him put in the dog house which he has been unable to get out of.

Nah, it's performance-based.